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Slavery in American History

By TChris, Section Civil Liberties
Posted on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 09:25:50 AM EST
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by TChris

During February, PBS will air Slavery and the Making of America, a four-part series "documenting the history of American slavery from its beginnings in the British colonies to its end in the Southern states and the years of post-Civil War Reconstruction."

As one reviewer notes, it's worth reflecting on the disgrace of our past to better comprehend the present.

To have a real understanding of America -- its history and its values, its economic growth and social order -- it's important to know more about slavery in America and its development and dimensions. In the words of James Oliver Horton, a professor at George Washington University, "Slavery was no side show in American history -- it was the main event."

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    Slavery in American History | 28 comments (28 topical)
    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#1)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 09:38:42 AM EST
    Well, I look forward to this series - it will be interesting in a lot of ways. I would take exception to the characterization that "Slavery was no side show in American history -- it was the main event." Certainly this was true in the south and it was a big deal constitutionally (3/5 anyone?) and in terms of our westward expansion, but the primary economic and literary engine of our country for the first 100 years, the north/north-east was blissfully free of both slavery and (largely) controversy about it. Faulkner, we should all be forced to read Faulkner. :-) -C

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#2)
    by Darryl Pearce on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 09:53:37 AM EST
    "...blissfully free of both slavery and (largely) controversy about it." Vermont's original constitution (when it was an independent republic) was the first to outlaw slavery... in 1777. Here's a good place to start research: Slavery in the North. If it's the main event: ...bringing slaves to the continent ...chasing off the indigenous people Sounds like a double-feature

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#3)
    by Darryl Pearce on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 10:03:37 AM EST
    For those desk-bound, keyboard jockeys, here's an interesting site on population information: An historical Census browser out of the University of Virginia library.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#4)
    by john horse on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 10:26:09 AM EST
    The abolition of slavery was controversial in the North. Early abolitionists were physically attacked and their presses destroyed. They were probably the first protest movement. Under Spanish rule, Florida, like Canada, provided refuge and freedom for runaway slaves. Not only were runaway slaves welcome in Spanish Florida but they were also welcomed and integrated with the Seminoles (they and their descendents are known as Black Seminoles). This sanctuary posed a direct threat to the institution of slavery in the South and was one of the main causes of the Seminole Wars. Even after the Seminoles were forced to go to Oklahoma Territory, the issue of slavery came up again. In order to prevent Indians from providing sanctuary to runaway slaves, the practice of slavery was encouraged among Southern Indians. During the Civil War, there was a mini-civil war between those Indians who supported slavery and those, like the Seminoles, who didn't.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#5)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 10:37:13 AM EST
    According to Michael Marcarvage of Repent America, slavery is "not in the sense of based on the color of someone's skin, but about how people were admitted into voluntary slavery based on them wanting to be in service to others." So apparently, according to the Christian Right's new poster boy, slaves were just volunteers who did it for the sake of the work.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#6)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 10:47:18 AM EST
    Which is made more interesting by the fact that the abolitionist movement, when it was at its fever pitch in the middle of the nineteenth century, was very much a child of firebrand evangelcial Puritanism. See such figures as Theodore Parker and Edward Everett. How sad now, then, to see one of the major feathers in the cap of American Protestantism turned against itself, as today's Southern Protestant might as easily be seen sporting a Confederate Flag on his truck as speaking against injustices. And please, no prattling of "Heritage Not Hate." That flag is a perfect analog for the swastika, pure and simple, and I wish the nation as a whole would scorn it.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#7)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 11:09:00 AM EST
    Slavery is a stain on the American soul; a stain that is only made worse by the hypocrisy of the document by which we proclaimed ourselves to be free.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#8)
    by desertswine on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 12:15:21 PM EST
    In many ways we are still living with the horrible effects of slavery from 1620 on, even in the "blissfully free" areas of the country.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#9)
    by soccerdad on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 12:16:56 PM EST
    blissfully free of both slavery
    My family had 2 slaves in Connecticuit in the 1700's It's in a family log/diary about when they were set free but i can't remember the date. I'll have to ask my father who has the book

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#10)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 12:29:15 PM EST
    As I recall from a long ago research paper on the runup to the civil war the "northeast proper" (what we'd call blue states today :-) had 2x the population of the "true south", 3x the industrial capability, 4x the miles of railroad, 1/3 the land under crop, and 1/250th the slave population. I can't recall the exact states I used but the south ended up 'round virginia, I excluded Maryland, and I was not counting the 'border' areas like MO. Bad scientific method (hey, I was in 8th grade!) but the numbers always stuck with me. If you read the histories of the congress/senate from the 1850's on (the new biography of Jeff Davis is quite good - 75% of it is leadup) it is amazing how little of the business was about slavery per-se but was focused on westward expansion and tariffs. -C

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#11)
    by soccerdad on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 12:43:05 PM EST
    Thats only one time point

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#12)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 12:56:56 PM EST
    "...the north/north-east was blissfully free of both slavery and (largely) controversy about it. Slavery was not abolished in New York state until 1827, although that was the end result of a system of gradual emancipation that had started with the 1799 "Act for the Gradual Abolition of Slavery", which freed all future-born children of slaves (although, technically it said that all children of slaves would serve as indentured servants to the mother's master until age 28). The Syracuse area was a hotbed of abolitionism (the famous "Jerry Rescue" took place in 1851). Of course, the whole Central New York area was always kind of weird, what with Women's Rights coming out of Seneca Falls, abolitionism in Syracuse, and "free love" over in Oneida.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#13)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 02:10:34 PM EST
    Gee, soccer, duh. And what direction do you think the trends were running in at that point in time? Good lord. -C

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#14)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 03:10:55 PM EST
    Yes, 450,000 white guys/18,000 black guys died to end it. Do you know who your people are? and what your people did at that time? its a nation that paid for that evil with the blood of its children, and what other nation or race paid that cost in blood? for others? Look up the bush family 1861/65

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#15)
    by soccerdad on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 03:23:03 PM EST
    Gee cliff you started by making a blanket statement, then when called on it you try to weasel out of it by citing a single period. think as a brick

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#16)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 04:30:36 PM EST
    Soccer - Dumb as a brick is what you are. The north was steadily pulling away from the south in terms of industrial capacity by the beginning of the 19th century. The destruction of the South's infrastructure and the pillaging of the remaining assets during Jackson's Reconstruction merely sealed the South's fate as a low-cost labor and food market for another 80 years. I was offering a point in time comparison, but if that's too complex for you then how about this: North have many factories and trains, south much land and slaves. Bad south, bad, north beat on you. Ugh. Idiot. -C

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#17)
    by soccerdad on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 04:41:05 PM EST
    Cliff since you don't read your own stuff
    but the primary economic and literary engine of our country for the first 100 years, the north/north-east was blissfully free of both slavery and (largely) controversy about it.
    Don't like being called on one of your usual throw aaway posts that hasn;t been thought out. Tough. Deal with it.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#18)
    by Sailor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 05:37:53 PM EST
    C'mon guys, knock it off, this has been one of the most informative and civil threads so far. To me the stupidest thing about slavery is that the South's argument for it was economic. It's cheaper to have migrant labor and a factory store.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#19)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 06:04:31 PM EST
    So, it would have been cheaper to have migrant workers? The plantation owners just maintained the slavery system out of their sense of responsibility? I think there is an economic analysis titled "time on the cross" that breaks down the economics of slavery and found it to be profitable and generally stable in prebellum south. It was not going anywhere and was not going to be replaced by NAFTA.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#20)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 06:32:53 PM EST
    I hate to be the resident historian... but... my degree finally pays off! In regards to the northern economy, northern states' economies essentially grew in concert with slave-produced cotton, as New England factories voraciously consumed the southern staple from the late 1700s onward. The need for wheat that was only grown on a small scale in the South and New England helped in westward expansion and the development of cities such as Chicago. So slavery played a pivotal part in all the development of our country. Furthermore, the reason slavery was not much of a congressional topic was that it had effectively been tabled as a non-touchable issue as a result of the Compromise of 1850. The majorities in both the North and the South essentially agreed to never discuss slavery. So northern politicians were essentially complicit in slavery through non-action. As far as the economics of slavery in the South; of course it was profitable for those who could afford to own slaves. Owning slaves, however, also served a social/political purpose, as it showed the wealth and distinction of a family. Wealthy northerners of that era, I would add, had few qualms about associating with the southern slave aristocracy. Abolitionism was definitely a fringe movement as late as the 1850s. As a result, slavery, I would argue, did define antebellum America.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#21)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 07:45:44 PM EST
    Here's an interesting article on slavery. In fact, it's got information about slaves in different countries and times: 2.1 Slavery in the Mediterranean world 2.2 Slavery in the Bible 2.2.1 Old Testament 2.3 Slavery in Rome and Greece 2.4 Slavery in medieval Europe 2.5 Slavery in medieval Arabia 2.6 Slavery to North Africa 2.7 Slavery in Africa 2.8 African slaves versus Caribbean slaves 2.9 Slavery in colonial America 2.10 Slavery among indigenous people of the Americas 2.11 Slavery in the Spanish New World colonies 2.12 Slavery in the English and French Caribbean 2.13 Slavery in Brazil 2.14 Slavery in North America 2.15 Slavery in Japan Despite that, I and every white American are particularly guilty, and genetically so.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#22)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 08:37:18 PM EST
    Genetically guilty? Rubbish. If such a thing existed (and it does not), all white German-Americans would be guilty of Nazism, too, and should suffer for it. Let's not forget that there were black slave owners--so, would that make all living African-Americans genetically guilty of slavery, too? Shame on them! Well, no. I am in no more guilty of the horror of slavery than of the exploits of Clovis, King of the Franks...and unless you are at least 140 years old, you probably aren't either. Slavery's burdens may extend to the present, but the guilt? Guilt is specific--it belongs to the guilty. And however it deflates one's bent toward self-flaggelation, those guilty of slaveowning are quite dead.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#23)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 12:00:49 AM EST
    Carter: I think Lonewacko was being ironic. That was my interpretation anyway. Glanton: You bring up an interesting point-- Christian religious groups have often been forces for justice (back when 'love thy neighbor' outweighed the current interpretation of 'an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth'). As recently as the 60's, the right wingnuts considered the Catholic church to be a bunch of left wingnuts because they participated in the civil rights movement and were against the war in Vietnam. It's funny how the pendulum swings back and forth, both politically and religiously, at a fairly regular and predictable rate over the course of modern history. It just seems that as everything else has accelerated over the past 50 years (technology, population growth, the fall of communism and apartheid, etc.) the pendulum of popular thought has sped up too, just not quite at the same rate. I think it leaves all of us a little bewildered at times.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#24)
    by john horse on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 05:22:02 AM EST
    re: "the north/north-east was blissfully free of both slavery and (largely) controversy about it." One thing that slavery did bequeath upon the South was what my history professor called the rail system, with the Southern aristocrats on the top rail, middle class whites next, poor whites next to the bottom, and blacks on the bottom. Thats not to say that there is not racism and socio-economic class divisions in the North. Its just that these are more deeply engrained in the South. The problem is that there are still too many Southerners (including many of my relatives) who haven't been able to shake the curse. Anyway, thats my interpretation of what Cliff means by Northerners being "blissfully" free of slavery and his reference to Faulkner.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#25)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 07:52:10 AM EST
    This should be a very good show on a subject I didn't learn about until doing research in College. African's were indentured and then enslaved simply because caucasion servants immigrating from Europe basically kept dying. The Africans were stronger and healthier, and saved many a settlement from ruin by bringing skills such as indigo making or rice growing to the New World. In addition, we totally screwed the blacks in the post-emancipation period (the ones we didn't kill, that is), and have continued to belittle them for the "crime" of being enslaved. Honestly, it reminds me of the way women who are raped by enemy troops are treated in some countries, i.e. "we're really sorry it happenend, but could you just get over it please and stop talking about it"? In non-practical terms, this country owes African Americans a wealth of gratitude and capital and I try not to forget it as a white woman. I make a point not to participate in racist conversations or pretend racist comments are funny. Even though my family is third generation American and weren't slave owners, I benefit from being blond haired and blue eyed. People open doors for me. I can "cuff" a coffee at Starbucks if I forget my purse. I get a free paper from the newspaper guy sometimes. I've had pot in my car and not gotten searched when stopped. And I'm much more likely to marry a caucasion man who is much more likely (on average!) to have considerably more assets than the men my Af-Am sisters are likely to end up with. So, I do feel responsible, and ashamed for my ancestors. And, furious that slavery is still going on in PLAIN SIGHT of the world in it's knowledge of the suffering. THIS is what we all should feel guilty about. In the meantime, I smile at black folks and look them in the eye to let them know I see them as human. I've read the most heartbreaking of Toni Morisson (Forget about Faulkner - I think everyone in this country should be required to read Beloved). I've even dated a few black guys and am embarrassed to admit what a big deal it was to overcome the extreme predjudice my "Blue State" very Christian parents had raised me with. But mostly, I listen. Because that's what, in my opinion, white folks have not done. We've told blacks to get over it, much the way an errant husband, after being caught having an affair, tells his wife to "get over it. It's in the past". Dr. Phil says, in the relationship example, that the only way for the relationship to be fixed is for the husband to listen to the wife until he truly understands how much he's hurt her and what his actions have made her feel like. It's hard to listen to how you've hurt people, especially if you didn't mean to. But I'm trying.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 08:06:34 AM EST
    mfox - Sorry, but I don't buy the "collective guilt" thing. And since I have never hurt a black, and never owned a slave, I certainly don't feel any special need. What I do feel is that all people are created equal. Period. I'll take anyone on that basis. I did support affrimative action to ensure that blacks, who had suffered from a poor educational system, a leg up into the system. But even that appears to be less and less needed. So save your sobs, and if you feel that blacks are owed "captial," feel free to write as many personal checks as you desire.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#27)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 10:51:25 AM EST
    Fair enough, PPJ.

    Re: Slavery in American History (none / 0) (#28)
    by Johnny on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 07:14:15 PM EST
    So should people who have inherited wealth from former slaveowners cough it up? (I have no idea how much of that dirty money is still around, anyone know?)I mean, if blacks should "get over it", should also the wealth that was accrued by whipping them into work be distributed? I am just curious what people think... mfox, you came across only slightly condescending in your last post. Sorry.

    Slavery in American History | 28 comments (28 topical)