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When Sullivan writes: (5.00 / 6) (#9)
by Anne on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:05:14 PM EST
He's more like Jack Kennedy: cunning, ruthless, capable of political positioning as much as greatness.

it makes me realize that if only I could have some confidence, some sense of certainty, that Obama will apply those qualities to advancing a truly progressive agenda, I would not be feeling so reluctant to vote for him.

The truth for me is that those qualities, in the absence of core beliefs, spell disaster and danger, which is why I cannot stop worrying about what he will really do if he is elected and has power to use as he sees fit.

Who is Barack Obama?  If I thought he knew, I'd feel a little better, but I think he's writing a story, not living his life.

This comment is just (5.00 / 4) (#10)
by frankly0 on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:08:20 PM EST
bizarrely ungrounded:

capable of political positioning as much as greatness.

How does any sentient being make such a pronouncement at this stage about Obama? Where is there, anywhere, something that one could concretely point to as evidence that Obama is "capable of greatness"?

The hagiography never ends. Common sense never intrudes.

[ Parent ]

I was focusing more on the (5.00 / 1) (#17)
by Anne on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:15:12 PM EST
"ruthless, cunning and caoable of political positioning" part of that quote, obviously.

Is he equally capable of political positioning and greatness?  I guess that would depend on what his positions were, and what the result of the positioning was.

[ Parent ]

I didn't mean (5.00 / 2) (#35)
by frankly0 on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:28:20 PM EST
to imply that your own comment had a problem with it. I was really reacting to Sullivan's bizarre comment.

In Sullivan's world, the hero worship simply can't be turned off.

If I had a wish, it would be that one's command of rhetoric were exactly on a par with one's ability to think. If that were so, the Andrew Sullivans and Josh Marshalls and Maureen Dowds and Christopher Hitchens of the world would be exposed for the mediocre intellects they are, and could never achieve the prominence they have in today's media.

[ Parent ]

Unfounded (5.00 / 1) (#32)
by pie on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:24:02 PM EST
hyperbole.

And they wonder why we're unenthusiastic.

[ Parent ]

I won't quote Lloyd Bentsen (5.00 / 3) (#34)
by badger on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 04:26:30 PM EST
but I will say that JFK was elected on my 11th birthday, and as an 11-year-old I admired him greatly - maybe if I was still 11 I'd admire Obama as much.

JFK was able to be great at a time when the US dominated the world both economically and militarily, upward mobility and unions were more than a memory and we weren't bogged down in a quagmire in a foreign country. Charisma isn't much of technique for solving real-world problems (except for 11 year olds).

[ Parent ]

Your memory of JFK is rather rosy. (none / 0) (#125)
by oculus on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 10:55:45 PM EST
During his presidency, he authorized the Bay of Pigs invasion of Cuba, a fiasco; authorized increased involvement in Vietnam (a quagmire), and stared down Kruschev during the Cuban missle crisis.  

[ Parent ]
Exactly.. and Kennedy was far more (none / 0) (#129)
by MarkL on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 11:18:54 PM EST
experienced that Obama. Is Obama ready for an international crisis? I see nothing in his background to support and affirmative answer to that question.


[ Parent ]
Hey, give the Senator a break already. (none / 0) (#130)
by oculus on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 11:22:32 PM EST
He's going to Iraq in July.

[ Parent ]
obama is not jfk. he is who he is period. (none / 0) (#119)
by hellothere on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 10:00:20 PM EST
like he has said, he is a blank slate upon whom his experiences, writing, and actions speak only for him and him alone. to try and dress himself up in camelot is just not factual.

[ Parent ]
Ted Kennedy tried to "dress him (none / 0) (#131)
by zfran on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 11:41:16 PM EST
up" as JFK! When JFK was president, I believe Teddy was still a kid. What he probably knows about JFK's presidency, was told to him.    

[ Parent ]
Hardly. TK is 73 or 74 now. Do the math. (none / 0) (#136)
by MarkL on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 12:04:34 AM EST
He's been a Senator since the 60's---I believe he took over RFK's seat.

[ Parent ]
76 per recent reports of his illness. (none / 0) (#137)
by oculus on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 12:06:07 AM EST


[ Parent ]
Okay, like I said above, I stand (none / 0) (#139)
by zfran on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 12:08:25 AM EST
corrected. Mixed up my dates.

[ Parent ]
JFK's Senate seat was filled (none / 0) (#149)
by oculus on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 01:27:09 AM EST
by Benjamin Atwood Smith II.  Teddy Kennedy succeeded Smith.


[ Parent ]
Ted represents MA (none / 0) (#158)
by samanthasmom on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 07:39:49 AM EST
Bobby represented New York

[ Parent ]

Flexible | 185 comments (185 topical)

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