home
Friday Afternoon Open Thread | 244 comments (244 topical)
Teddy K (5.00 / 7) (#5)
by nell on Fri May 09, 2008 at 12:49:11 PM EST
Ted Kennedy says no VP spot for Clinton. I say good becuase she will be President, and even if not, she doesn't need to be training her boss. But just check out his reasons:

Kennedy: No veep slot for Clinton
It's fun to think about, but there are so many obstacles, and Ted Kennedy isn't buying, he said on Bloomberg Television's "Political Capital With Al Hunt," which airs this weekend.
Obama should choose a running mate who "is in tune with his appeal for the nobler aspirations of the American people," Kennedy said. "If we had real leadership -- as we do with Barack Obama -- in the No. 2 spot as well, it'd be enormously helpful."

Yes, please keep telling me I have to support your boy in November for the sake of Roe v. Wade.

It's comments like these (5.00 / 7) (#7)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 12:51:02 PM EST
Obama should choose a running mate who "is in tune with his appeal for the nobler aspirations of the American people," Kennedy said. "If we had real leadership -- as we do with Barack Obama -- in the No. 2 spot as well, it'd be enormously helpful."

which make me wonder if ol' Ted has fallen off the wagon again. In what universe has Obama shown any leadership qualities to date? I guess my definition of 'noble' and his are very different.

[ Parent ]

Oh, so now we are not noble either? (5.00 / 8) (#18)
by BarnBabe on Fri May 09, 2008 at 12:58:36 PM EST
Obama should choose a running mate who "is in tune with his appeal for the nobler aspirations of the American people,"
Just keep digging you guys and your base is taking a walk. Or, maybe the idea is to elect John McCain just as long as it is not Hillary. Seems we have a whole group of Cheneys wanting to get into power.

[ Parent ]
Yikes even Ted has insulted us. (5.00 / 6) (#30)
by Maria Garcia on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:06:39 PM EST
Im kind of shocked by this, actually.

[ Parent ]
He's (5.00 / 5) (#34)
by TeresaInSnow2 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:08:08 PM EST
still peeved about not bringing Massachusetts for Obama.

He's being passive aggressive.

[ Parent ]

Deval Patrick (5.00 / 2) (#66)
by kempis on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:19:20 PM EST
...has probably helped to sour a lot of Massachusetts voters on Obama, who actually does not poll very well against McCain there.

I have some friends in Massachusetts who report that Patrick, who wooed the voters with an Axelrod-orchestrated campaign promising "hope" and "change" {erp}, has hit the ground with a sickening thud. He's been a pretty resounding disappointment, promising a "new politics" and delivering the same old corruption and obvious pandering.

It seems the loftier the campaign rhetoric, the harder the fall.

[ Parent ]

Mass. and Deval (none / 0) (#102)
by Binx on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:36:17 PM EST
The real thud for Deval has been running into the buzz-saw of Speaker of the House Sal DiMasi. That and his support for casinos (which DiMasi was against). As a MA resident I'll give you that you have an argument for the "pandering" but the "corruption" and "politics as usual" is not from Deval, it's the entrenched, party-pols that control everything. There's no new politics unless it's THEIR new politics.

[ Parent ]
Yup (5.00 / 0) (#109)
by CST on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:40:10 PM EST
I think Deval gets a bad rep.  We have the best economy in the country right now in Mass with really low unemployment and actually some economic growth.  Sure, there are problems, but given that we are in a national recession I'd say someone's doing a pretty good job.  The casino thing is a little stupid, but not a dealbreaker for me at least.

[ Parent ]
Casinos (none / 0) (#132)
by DFLer on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:50:46 PM EST
Are the proposed casinos privately or publically owned? Are they NA owned and operated?

[ Parent ]
The bill failed but.... (none / 0) (#141)
by Binx on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:56:17 PM EST
The bill didn't pass but the idea was 3 private casinos. I'm not for the casinos so I must admit I didn't pay that close attention.


[ Parent ]
Not to mention CA. (none / 0) (#72)
by oculus on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:22:35 PM EST


[ Parent ]
Ted insulted us when (5.00 / 8) (#35)
by Stellaaa on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:08:23 PM EST
he said he was passing the torch.  As if the torch was his to pass.  That really did me in.  I lost any affection I had for the guy.  

[ Parent ]
Sounds more like he's in charge of the (5.00 / 3) (#69)
by Anne on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:20:50 PM EST
torches and the pitchforks to me.

Honestly, I was more offended by his comments about the nobler aspirations - for one because I think there is a lot of nobility in working to better people's lives - and I emphasize "working" because with Obama showing all the signs of being averse to work, the last thing we need is a VP with his head in the, um, clouds all the time, too.

I get that it's important to inspire people, but come on - how much more inspiration do people need to fix energy and health care and foreign policy than sky-high-and rising energy costs, more and more people without health insurance and a war that seems to be on a path toward endless?  Sure, he can wax poetic, have people fainting in the aisles at the sheer brilliance and beauty of his rhetoric ( which I really don't see, myself), but that isn't going to help me pay my health insurance premiums, or fill my tank or help me put food on the table.

Why do they not get that?


[ Parent ]

Ted Kennedy (none / 0) (#80)
by bjorn on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:26:38 PM EST
is a sad, sad man.  He is "bitter" and "clinging" to the glory days of his brothers.  It is only going to take a couple more comments like this to push me over the edge and join the Don't Vote for Obama gang.  Their comments just make Obama look bad and they cast doubt on his ability to unite the party.  

[ Parent ]
Maria....How Can You Be Surprised By (5.00 / 3) (#38)
by PssttCmere08 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:09:01 PM EST
anything anymore...I am not surprised, but I am certainly displeased everytime one of these morons come up with another lame argument against Hillary.  Kennedy is just trying to stay relevant, but is doing a lousy job.

[ Parent ]
I sure think McCain (5.00 / 3) (#39)
by abfabdem on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:09:25 PM EST
has been given a huge opening to appeal to older voters since we have been trashed by our own party who thinks we do not matter and are not needed.  Thanks Donna, "progressive" blogs and Air America.  We can take the hint.

[ Parent ]
CNN uses "WORM" :-) (none / 0) (#244)
by Cream City on Fri May 09, 2008 at 04:07:22 PM EST
Looking at my TV screen right now, CNN's banner is:

"Losing His Bearings" Uproar
What Obama Really Meant

Are the media starting to mock Obama with this acronmyn so common in blogspace?

[ Parent ]

He was never on the wagon (5.00 / 1) (#25)
by andgarden on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:05:01 PM EST


[ Parent ]
I agree (none / 0) (#29)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:06:22 PM EST
he's as dry as W.

[ Parent ]
Ah, well, he claimed to be. (none / 0) (#162)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:05:57 PM EST
You're right -- silly me for actually believing anything he says anymore.

[ Parent ]
Wow (5.00 / 7) (#49)
by chrisvee on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:13:19 PM EST
Here's  part of the problem.  With party elders saying things like this (Clinton doesn't share noble aspirations for the American people??  Clinton doesn't provide real leadership??) how do we expect unity?  

I feel as if we're hurtling towards a cliff.  BTD said many weeks ago that things need to be dialed back a bit and he looked to the Obama campaign to set the tone (I hope I'm doing justice to his thoughts and not misrepresenting them).  No one is listening and instead we're getting this pile on situation that is only going to carve the divisions deeper.

I'm getting very depressed about November.

[ Parent ]

Unfortunately for ol' Teddy (5.00 / 1) (#59)
by txpolitico67 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:16:58 PM EST
the state of Massachusetts disagrees with him.  Has he not picked up a hometown paper or turned on the news in MA?

[ Parent ]
I rarely if ever use the (5.00 / 1) (#101)
by ruffian on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:35:43 PM EST
Oh.My.God  construct, but

Oh. My. God.  

and I'll add:

Wow. Just...wow.

[ Parent ]

Says the guy who went to the convention (5.00 / 7) (#8)
by Jim J on Fri May 09, 2008 at 12:51:07 PM EST
against Jimmy Carter a lot further behind than Hillary is now.

[ Parent ]
Ted was way, way behind (5.00 / 5) (#41)
by datadriven on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:10:13 PM EST
The delegate tally at the convention was in part:

Jimmy Carter - 2,129.02
Ted Kennedy- 1,150.48
Hugh Carey - 16
William Proxmire - 10
14 others - 40.5

Carter led Kennedy by about 2.7 million in the popular vote, and total turnout was a fraction of what it was this year.

Carter was desperate to heal the wounds caused by the infighting. And there's probably video on the web somewhere of Carter akwardly following Kennedy around the stage at the end of Kennedy's speech trying to stand next to him.

[ Parent ]

In other words... (5.00 / 13) (#19)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 12:59:28 PM EST
Hillary, with her decades of Party loyalty, exemplary service, legislative achievements, very high public approval in her state as Senator, and 91% Progressive voting record, is not fit to tie the shoes of an inexperienced, elitist, lying, race-baiting empty suit.

Explain to me how that is anything but misogyny.

Ted Kennedy 2.0 should be very, very ashamed of himself right now.

[ Parent ]

Give me a break (5.00 / 1) (#44)
by CST on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:11:36 PM EST
Condescending, yes.  Unhelpful to the Democratic party, yes.  Stupid, yes.  Misogynistic?????  HOW?   Let's stop reading everything as a gender vs. race thing for once and just let people's words mean what they mean without spinning them.

[ Parent ]
Don't tell me how to feel about what he said. (5.00 / 5) (#62)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:18:53 PM EST
There is no logical basis for his words except misogyny. In every fact-based respect, HRC is much more qualified and more of a leader than Obama. You simply cannot argue that. What strong leadership positions has he taken as a Senator? Does he have more, or less, experience than HRC?

Every freaking time anyone brings up the misogyny directed towards HRC we are shouted down. And almost always...by males. Yet the words "fairy tale" are somehow racist. Puh-freaking-leez.

[ Parent ]

Let's not jump to conclusions (5.00 / 1) (#74)
by CST on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:23:29 PM EST
First of all, I am not a male.  Second of all, I never claimed "fairy-tale" was racist - that's my point, it's gone too far on BOTH sides.  Finally, maybe, just maybe, he doesn't like Hillary for his own personal reasons.  I am not saying he should've said what he said, obviously it was stupid and unhelpful.  But lets leave people the personal freedom to have an opinion without assuming they are being biased because of race or gender.  Just because you disagree with him doesn't make it misogynist.

[ Parent ]
His statement was not (5.00 / 6) (#89)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:32:02 PM EST
that he didn't like Hillary. It was that she did not have the leadership quality of Obama and did not represent the nobler aspirations of the Democratic Party the way he did.

There is no factual basis for what Ted said. What other conclusion am I supposed to draw? He hates HRC for her freedoms?

Please, disagree with me if you'd like, but stop telling me how to feel and what I'm seeing with my own eyes. I'm forty years old and I know misogyny when I see it.

Thanks very much.

[ Parent ]

Right, it just makes him an embarassing (5.00 / 1) (#91)
by RalphB on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:32:27 PM EST
drunken a-shole, like lots of others in the dem congress.  He's got to be one of the biggest hypocrits around, considering the '80 race.

[ Parent ]
Sure (none / 0) (#94)
by CST on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:34:10 PM EST
No problem with that statement.

I am not trying to defend Kennedy by any means.

[ Parent ]

It's like people who ask . . . (5.00 / 3) (#77)
by Palomino on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:25:43 PM EST
"If Hillary were a man, would it be sexist for <Obama> <the MCM> <Obama's supporters> to <fill in the blank>?"

If Hillary were a man, Obama wouldn't even be in this thing anymore.

[ Parent ]

He offered women kisses (5.00 / 1) (#120)
by abfabdem on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:44:29 PM EST
for votes at some campaign stops.  Yuck.

[ Parent ]
Also used the "Sweetie" word again (5.00 / 1) (#215)
by nycstray on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:42:19 PM EST
yesterday. ARGH.

[ Parent ]
Ted Kennedy??? (none / 0) (#204)
by CST on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:30:19 PM EST
Really, ew.....

[ Parent ]
No, Senator Obama did that. n/t (none / 0) (#211)
by eleanora on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:36:40 PM EST


[ Parent ]
IS there... (none / 0) (#125)
by Binx on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:46:17 PM EST
Is there any chance folks are parsing Kennedy's words too intensely? I mean, there is a way to interpret his use of the word "nobler" as merely reflecting the overall them of "Hope." Just because he used the word "nobler" doesn't make Hillary "not-nobler".

[ Parent ]
Reasonable people may disagree.... (5.00 / 1) (#149)
by Maria Garcia on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:59:57 PM EST
...but I tend to think he did in fact mean to suggest that Obama was noble, Clinton not so much.

[ Parent ]
Not to mention (5.00 / 3) (#167)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:08:37 PM EST
lacking in those leadership qualities that Obama apparently exudes. Sadly, I am too low-informed, under educated, female and old (even though I'm younger than BHO) to be able to perceive it.

[ Parent ]
Is this the tenor encouraged? (none / 0) (#249)
by chrisblask on Fri May 09, 2008 at 04:30:24 PM EST
is not fit to tie the shoes of an inexperienced, elitist, lying, race-baiting empty suit.

?

Just want to know what the groundrules are.

Is this a Dem/Progressive site or another Hillaryis44?  Is the site intended to promote Dem/Progressive candidates/issues or only a single person?

Seriously, just want to know where I am...

-chris

[ Parent ]

I Guess Ted Wouldn't Qualify for VP Either... (5.00 / 2) (#31)
by PssttCmere08 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:06:55 PM EST


[ Parent ]
And there in lies the problem (5.00 / 5) (#63)
by txpolitico67 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:18:56 PM EST
Kennedy and Kerry backing Obama is pure jealousy.  Ted could NEVER be JFK.  Kerry lost to a buffoon.

They should would hate for Hillary to pull off something NEITHER one of them could.  So what do they do?  Go against their entire state and support Obama.

How...presidential.

[ Parent ]

It begs the question (none / 0) (#100)
by JavaCityPal on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:35:33 PM EST
who Kennedy and Kerry think should be in the VP slot.

Kennedy exhausted his political capital years ago. He had to call on more popular members of his family to stand with him in his endorsement since his, alone, was without value.


[ Parent ]

Me thinks (none / 0) (#168)
by txpolitico67 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:09:26 PM EST
you're right.  Kennedy is basically done.  He's a member of the old guard that a true blue liberal and Massachusetts dem couldn't possibly vote against.  The sacrifices his family has made for our country is beyond reproach.  And don't forget the Special Olympics.

But I agree his political capital is probably all spent.  He's definitely using his no-hassle rewards card from Capital One at this point when it comes to political prowess.

[ Parent ]

I Will Be More Than Happy If Obama Picks (5.00 / 4) (#37)
by MO Blue on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:08:59 PM EST
someone else for VP.  Never thought it was a good idea to begin with. Obama's VP pick will not win my vote. It is up to Obama to win my vote.

Kennedy just couldn't help but put a dig at Hillary into his comment. Feel that unity. (sigh)

[ Parent ]

Perhaps he is still smarting (5.00 / 1) (#42)
by abfabdem on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:10:42 PM EST
that his own state voted for her despite his Obama endorsment.

[ Parent ]
If Obama is at the top of the ticket... (5.00 / 6) (#43)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:10:43 PM EST
we lose in November.

Hillary being VP would not help obviate his negatives.

Obama might even be too toxic for VP at this point.

[ Parent ]

Compare and contrast (5.00 / 5) (#73)
by chancellor on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:22:45 PM EST
John Edwards saying this morning how terrific both candidates are v. Ted Kennedy saying that only Obama provides real leadership. Which one do you think is the better Democrat?

[ Parent ]
Maybe it is time (5.00 / 3) (#123)
by Manuel on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:45:30 PM EST
for Ted Kennedy to be primaried.

[ Parent ]
LOL (none / 0) (#170)
by txpolitico67 on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:10:27 PM EST
hmmm, who do you propose?  Caroline?

[ Parent ]
Good. I don't want her as VP. (5.00 / 1) (#96)
by davnee on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:34:22 PM EST
I want her to run in 2012 clean of any association with Obama (and spared of the insult of playing Lily Tomlin to his Dabney Coleman).  Actually I was a bit put off by her use of the term "white" in her comments yesterday.  She's 100% correct, of course, and I don't think it's remotely racist to point out what she is pointing out, but I think she should tread carefully on this point in the current media environment.  I think she should keep an eye on 2012 and the need to make nice with AA's then.  She doesn't want to give the IACF lunatic meme even the slightest shred of credibility.  She needs to be pure to ride to the rescue in 2012.  Of course, if the Clintons know more than we do about her continued prospects for 2008, then I retract what I say and she should let it all fly now.

[ Parent ]
Heh. (5.00 / 2) (#111)
by madamab on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:40:15 PM EST
Excellent base-covering! :-)

Well, I know. I get kind of eeked out when she says stuff that could be interpreted as racist too.

You know what weirded me out? When her campaign said this:

"If you have a social need, you're with Hillary. If you want Obama to be your imaginary hip black friend and you're young and you have no social needs, then he's cool."

I thought, Ew! That is totally racist. WTF is she talking about?!

Amazingly, she always turns out to be right, though. Chris Bowers really proved her point. That description fits the Obama bloggers to a tee.

[ Parent ]

I can't believe this bs came out of Teddy's mouth (5.00 / 3) (#119)
by Monda on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:44:18 PM EST
These charges are piling up.  Racist, not noble, Bubba etc.  The GOP must be laughing, even they don't get this nasty.  

[ Parent ]
Set aside VP (none / 0) (#105)
by ruffian on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:38:08 PM EST
Does anyone still think she has a snowball's chance in Hades of being elected Senate Majority Leader?

I htink N.Y Governor, as someone suggested yeaterdya, is looking better all the time.

[ Parent ]

We have a Gov already (none / 0) (#134)
by nycstray on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:51:03 PM EST
and he seems to be ok so far.

[ Parent ]
And we don't need a governor.... (none / 0) (#192)
by kdog on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:21:32 PM EST
looking to use the governership as a springboard to something bigger and better...we already have a Senator who has her eyes on a bigger prize, and barely bothers to show up to work for us:)

[ Parent ]
It cracks me up how folks (none / 0) (#213)
by nycstray on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:41:14 PM EST
are taking other people's jobs to offer as a consolation prize for Clinton. When I heard the Gov one I just busted out laughing. iirc, it was right when our new one was sworn in. He hadn't even warmed the seat yet.

If she goes back to the Senate, I have a feeling we will have different representation.

[ Parent ]

You mean our (none / 0) (#227)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:55:11 PM EST
new new governor, don't you? The old new one sorta kinda messed up in a big way. ;)

[ Parent ]
Yes, our new, new one. lol!~ (none / 0) (#232)
by nycstray on Fri May 09, 2008 at 03:10:12 PM EST
That reminds me, need to call my friend. Our newest scandal is her rep I believe. {grin}

[ Parent ]
I love New York politics (none / 0) (#235)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 03:22:41 PM EST
I really do. It's always something!

[ Parent ]
Yeah, I'm gonna miss them (none / 0) (#240)
by nycstray on Fri May 09, 2008 at 03:50:43 PM EST
when I move, but then I'll have CA politics!

I love being a "Coastal Girl".

[ Parent ]

Meanwhile (none / 0) (#246)
by janarchy on Fri May 09, 2008 at 04:10:44 PM EST
I have to say I don't miss Chicago politics. (I used to live there and I hated every minute of it) Good luck in Cali!

[ Parent ]
What a coincidence!! (none / 0) (#220)
by abfabdem on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:48:50 PM EST
I have a Senator who hardly shows up for work!  In fact he missed more votes than any other Democratic candidate!!  

[ Parent ]
I hear that.... (none / 0) (#230)
by kdog on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:56:49 PM EST
That's why I think you would have to be nuts to vote for either one of them.

[ Parent ]
NO (none / 0) (#142)
by DFLer on Fri May 09, 2008 at 01:57:05 PM EST
she needs to be in a place where she can affect the NATIONAL agenda.

[ Parent ]
LOL (none / 0) (#152)
by zyx on Fri May 09, 2008 at 02:01:09 PM EST
None for Teddy, either.

Or--OMG!  Don't tell me???

[ Parent ]

Friday Afternoon Open Thread | 244 comments (244 topical)

  • Premium Ads

  • Blog Ads

  • Contribute To TalkLeft

    donate to TalkLeft