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Ted Kennedy, RFK, Progressive Values and Jack Newfield | 193 comments (193 topical)
You are deliberately (5.00 / 1) (#23)
by madamab on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:00:06 PM EST
misrepresenting what I said.

BTD, not quoting Kennedy, hopes Obama can be like RFK. I don't think he can; in fact, the one most like RFK in this race is Hillary. She is much more of a uniter than Obama.

I disagree with Ted Kennedy too, on many things, including Obama. I have great respect for Senator Kennedy nonetheless, and he can certainly say whatever he likes about his own brother.

I have great respect for BTD too.

[ Parent ]

We think Obama is a bigot. (5.00 / 1) (#45)
by lorelynn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:11:42 PM EST
RFK was not a bigot. Regardless of what Ted Kennedy thinks, we see comparing RFK, whom we admire,  to a morally inferior person like Obama as an insult. Misogyny is as bad as racism  and Obama himself, and many of his supporters, have repeatedly engaged in misogynistic behavior. That's why we regard it as an insult.

[ Parent ]
Obama has engaged in a mindboggling (5.00 / 3) (#65)
by lorelynn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:19:22 PM EST
amount of misogynist rhetoric for someone of his age and education. Then there is the fact that he has repeatedly exposed his daughters to Jeremiah Wright who engages in a tremendous amount of misogynist rhetoric. adn then there is obama's failure to ask his supporters to stop with the misogyny. Obama's a bigot.

Ted can say what he wants, but a lot of women will percieve that we do RFK's name no favors when we compare the two of them.

[ Parent ]

Well Ted Kennedy (none / 0) (#56)
by IndiDemGirl on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:15:47 PM EST
doesn't agree with you.  And I'll take his political opinion over yours, thank you.

[ Parent ]
And Boddy Kennedy Jr. (5.00 / 5) (#79)
by kenoshaMarge on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:24:13 PM EST
doesn't agree with his Uncle Ted either because he endorsed Hillary Clinton as did his sister.

[ Parent ]
Actually... (5.00 / 5) (#116)
by AmyinSC on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:39:45 PM EST
It was BOTH of his sisters...In other words, ALL of BOBBY'S children endorsed HILLARY.  The MSM only focused on Ted and Caroline, when at the same time, ALL of Bobby's came out in support of Hillary.  Very telling.

Then again, the MSM RARELY covers ANY of Clinton's endorsements (e.g., how many people know that some MAJOR Native American tribes have endorsed Clinton?  Yeah, that's what I thought.).  Robert DeNito endorses Obama, and it is ALL the MSM can talk abt, even though Jack Nicholson endorsed Clinton the SAME DAY.  NO ONE talked abt that!  

SO yeah - back to the issue at hand - Ted has had a long and distinguished career - nothing can detract from that.  But his brothers children obviously think Clinton has more in common with their father than Ted does.  For what that's worth.

[ Parent ]

the oldest were (5.00 / 2) (#124)
by bjorn on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:44:45 PM EST
about 16 or 17 I think, and there were 9 or something like that so they went down in age, the youngest I think was actually born after the assination.

[ Parent ]
heh, cross posts (none / 0) (#122)
by angie on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:43:30 PM EST
I just posted about RFK, Jr. down thread -- totally agreed -- they never mention that fact about Hillary, as they want us to believe "all the Kennedys" are behind Obama.

[ Parent ]
What a ridiculous argument (none / 0) (#154)
by joanneleon on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:28:44 PM EST
and how presumptuous of you.

Some Obama supporters (the most fanatical ones) will go to any length to discredit anyone who supports Hillary, to put a negative spin on any news that is positive to Hillary Clinton, and to otherwise deny her any possible good that may come her way.  Really, you should seek help.  I think the psych experts are going to need to add CDS as an official medical diagnosis soon.

[ Parent ]

Some Clinton supporters (none / 0) (#189)
by IndiDemGirl on Tue May 20, 2008 at 04:56:28 PM EST
(the most fanatical ones) will go to any length to discredit anyone who supports Obama, to put a negative spin on any news that is positive to Obama, and to otherwise deny him any possible good that may come his way.  

In this thread some Clinton supporters have implied that Senator Kennedy has been brain damaged by his tumor and that explains his support of Obama.  

What will the psych experts do with that.

[ Parent ]

Dueling Endorsements (none / 0) (#162)
by daring grace on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:42:20 PM EST
I don't really set much stock in endorsements, but while we're on this subject of competing Kennedys...

Ethel Kennedy endorsed Obama.

Does that make him more RFK-esque?

Who knows? Who cares, really?

I'm having trouble with the link so if you care to see it, you can go over to Huffington Post and find it under her name Ethel Skakel Kennedy on Feb. 2, 2008.



[ Parent ]

no one here endorses McCain (5.00 / 2) (#117)
by Capt Howdy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:40:10 PM EST
well, no one serious.

they may not endorse Obama either but it is not the same thing.

[ Parent ]

Exactly. (5.00 / 1) (#120)
by madamab on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:42:03 PM EST
Others may vote for McCain but I never, ever would.

OTOH, I wouldn't condemn anyone for their choice in 2008. We are all doing what we feel is right for ourselves and our country.

[ Parent ]

Quit the Super Delegates overturning the results. (5.00 / 2) (#166)
by alexei on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:46:18 PM EST
This is a fallacious statement.  The Super Delegates if they vote for Hillary are fulfilling their function which is to choose the candidate best able to win in November and to be the best President using their judgment.

The pledged delegate count is a flawed and ridiculous measure for "will of the people".  This has been pointed out many times here and just recently by BTD on the latest Nevada State Convention results.  The popular vote is the best measure for the "will of the people" and that includes FL and MI (funny how Dean hasn't mentioned his fifty state strategy for the Democratic Nomination).

If Hillary is the popular vote leader, her argument for following the results of the primary is stronger than the byzantine and arcane system of delegate selection that only Democrats could invent.  If I decide to stay in this Party, (and no, I don't plan on voting for McCain), then I will work to see the elimination of the proportional delegate allocation and of caucuses.

[ Parent ]

Superdelegates overturning the will of the people (5.00 / 1) (#176)
by g8grl on Tue May 20, 2008 at 04:02:34 PM EST
by voting for Clinton?  How often has that meme been proved inaccurate.  If the Superdelegates go for Clinton, it's no different than if the Superdelegates go for Obama.  I would argue that the Superdelegates going for Obama is overturning the results of the primaries since if they went with the way each of their states voted, Clinton would have won by now.  

[ Parent ]
I hear you and I have seen the comments (none / 0) (#137)
by Capt Howdy on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:54:42 PM EST
there are a lot of dashed dreams here.  give them some time.

[ Parent ]
Could we get back to the subject (none / 0) (#156)
by joanneleon on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:30:24 PM EST
of Senator Kennedy's health and career?

[ Parent ]
Huh? (none / 0) (#159)
by squeaky on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:39:15 PM EST
The topic is not Senator Kennedy's health. There is another thread to discuss Senator Kennedy's health although that would not be OT here, I am sure.

This is topical, as distasteful as it may be to you:

And then he mentioned that Senator Kennedy was hoping to see in Barack Obama what he had seen from his brother Robert F. Kennedy - the ability to bring the white working class together with African Americans, Latinos, the old and the young. Whether Obama can do do that, and we all hope he can,



[ Parent ]
For pity's sake, read closely (5.00 / 4) (#49)
by Cream City on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:13:04 PM EST
as that is BTD quoting Chris Matthews.

And consult a calendar.  The story here is from 2002 and would not have mentioned Barack Obama.  Nobody outside of Chicago knew who the heck he was then, before the Kennedy-Kerry machine picked him to elevate to stardom in 2004.

[ Parent ]

Your Reading Comprehension Could Use Some Work (5.00 / 4) (#61)
by MO Blue on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:17:07 PM EST
Tweety was opining on Kennedy's hopes. That was not a direct quote from Ted Kennedy.

In your last two comments you have made it clear that you have no intentions other than distort what people on this cite say and to stir up trouble. If you are actually an Obama supporter, your actions are totally counterproductive. If you are a Republican troll, please crawl back into your hole.

[ Parent ]

I will respond one last time. (none / 0) (#37)
by madamab on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:10:31 PM EST
And then he mentioned that Senator Kennedy was hoping to see in Barack Obama what he had seen from his brother Robert F. Kennedy - the ability to bring the white working class together with African Americans, Latinos, the old and the young. Whether Obama can do do that, and we all hope he can...

That is the part I was talking about.

I don't hope he can. I know he can't because he doesn't want to.

[ Parent ]

No you don't know. (5.00 / 2) (#75)
by Faust on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:23:21 PM EST
Here is where I depart from ardent Clinton supporters. You DO NOT KNOW. You should not PRESUME to know. Very few of us KNOW, with certainty, much of anything (I try to be Socratic with regard to knowledge).  

It MAY BE that you are correct in your assesment of Obama. But none of us know what the future holds with certainty.

Of course BTD hopes that Obama MIGHT do great things. If Obama becomes a better man, a better leader, then that would be good for all of us.

Doubting him is fine. There are many valid criticisms that can be leveled against him. But to categoricaly state that there is NO WAY that he could do great things because he is so fundamentaly corrupt in his character is a bit arrogant in my opinion. All people have the capacity for redemption.

[ Parent ]

That's fine... (none / 0) (#87)
by madamab on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:26:45 PM EST
we can agree to disagree.


[ Parent ]
Fair enough. (none / 0) (#113)
by Faust on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:37:22 PM EST


[ Parent ]
You must be joking. (1.00 / 1) (#51)
by madamab on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:13:15 PM EST
I bolded the part I was talking about.

The part BTD added.

You are being a total jerk.

[ Parent ]

STOP IT (5.00 / 1) (#115)
by JavaCityPal on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:39:43 PM EST
It's become impossible to figure out who is the troll.

[ Parent ]
Well (5.00 / 1) (#175)
by chrisvee on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:59:22 PM EST
I'm starting to think that's the point.  Clearly the trolls aren't here to convert anyone. They apparently are here to create chaos so that eventually everyone just throws up their hands in disgust and leaves or TL shuts down comments.  The point is the chilling effect on the conversation, I think.

I'm grossly off topic so I'll just close by saying that I appreciate getting to read these fine words written about Ted Kennedy who is I think one of the rate politicians who is actually worthy of admiration.

[ Parent ]

Ugh--out of the blue: (none / 0) (#102)
by Molly Pitcher on Tue May 20, 2008 at 02:31:41 PM EST
No one is quoting Kennedy, but someone is trying to describe why the author thought Kennedy made the endorsement.  That way, reading another person's mind, is a minefield.  Best not go that direction.

Frankly this part of the thread has my mind reeling.  I think some of us said Obama is not an RFK re-incarnation.  Legal remark, I think.  And if anyone insulted RFK, I missed it--and will continue to miss it because these comments have exceedingly dubious roots.

[ Parent ]

I think Kucinich.... (none / 0) (#161)
by kdog on Tue May 20, 2008 at 03:42:05 PM EST
was the most like RFK policy wise.  RFK would think Hillary and Obama are Republicans.

[ Parent ]

Ted Kennedy, RFK, Progressive Values and Jack Newfield | 193 comments (193 topical)

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