TalkLeft: The Politics Of Crime

Sunday Open Thread With Obama On Fox | 260 comments (260 topical)

I think they could have ben relevant (5.00 / 9) (#7)
by Big Tent Democrat on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:03:40 AM EST

IF they had been issue centric and pressed the candidates on issues. Instead they became candidate centric and thus irrelevant.

[ Parent ]

I agree on the candidate centrism. (5.00 / 9) (#13)
by Fabian on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:10:47 AM EST

It's be one thing if they actually had objective candidate support - constructive criticism, listed policy deficiencies as well as engaging in team building and organizational support.

But when The Candidate is held blameless and The Media and The Opponent and even The Public are the ones criticized in their stead, blogs aren't a useful, not even as a focus group. Maybe as a real time sociology experiment in psy ops, but little else.

I still think that TL is great. Here there's no reluctance to examine the issues. (as opposed to a obsession with spinning them.)

[ Parent ]

What do you call it (5.00 / 1) (#24)
by Burned on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:20:52 AM EST

When you laugh and sigh at the same time?

"Maybe as a real time sociology experiment in psy ops, but little else."

Very funny line, very true and very sad.
It's been a huge letdown.

[ Parent ]

: saughing? (5.00 / 2) (#33)
by Salo on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:26:47 AM EST

Good natured self-depreciating resignation?

[ Parent ]
: top o' the rec list (none / 0) (#161)
by Fabian on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 11:00:05 AM EST

A diary I had no problem with (propaganda, but fairly benign stuff) until the tip jar stated "It's not like he is consistently using the media to espouse openly right-wing framing, the way his Democratic opponent is.".
Then he lost me. They just can't resist it!

[ Parent ]

TL (5.00 / 3) (#32)
by AnninCA on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:26:08 AM EST

is quite a bit more objective than say, Huffington Post. The story is the story, and then opinion is added but clearly indicated.

The other key is that the comment policy allows for differing opinions but watches the flaming.

That will be the go-forward model for blogs that would like to succeed, in my opinion.

[ Parent ]

: Relative Objectivity... (5.00 / 1) (#114)
by DanR3 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 10:32:31 AM EST

I started visiting this blog more frequently after super tuesday simply because it was one of the few blogs remaining that allowed HRC supporters to actually voice an opinion without getting immediately pounced on by Obama supporters or banned by the site owners.
I wouldn't go so far as to describe TL as being "objective" though, other than by adding some balance to the rest of the noise.

[ Parent ]

I agree with you about (5.00 / 4) (#58)
by pie on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:48:22 AM EST

the fact that they became candidate centric, although a few tried to remain neutral. It just got harder as the vitriol increased and the supporters became more defensive/offensive. Issues couldn't even be discussed without the thread devolving into name-calling and accusations. People began bashing people who represent their own values and support many of the same democratic ideals that they do. How can you do that and not see the damage you're doing to the party as a whole? I know many are totally frustrated after the events of the last seven to eight years, and some wanted radical change NOW. Not going to happen. I'm really angry at some of the bloggers and MoveOn for feeding the frenzy. They've managed to diminish their good work by taking the positions they did, at least AFAIC. And after worrying about government intervention and republican tricks, they did it to themselves!!!!

The blogs are shaped to a large degree by its participants. You guys have attempted to keep trolling to a minimum and posts on topic. For that I thank you. Others should have followed your lead and tried to remain more objective, despite their personal feelings. Blogs are supposed to represent all of us, not just the ones who support one candidate or the other.

There'll have to be a lot of introspection, accountability and healing after this.
I hope we're mature enough to do all of that, but I'm not very optimistic.

[ Parent ]

My normie (5.00 / 1) (#122)
by AnninCA on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 10:36:59 AM EST

friends are far more interested in other stuff in life than this election. They aren't going to need to "heal."

As for blogger-world, myself included, the obsession with the race is our responsibility. Obsession is obsession. Unhealthy stuff....but rather fun. :)

I'm convinced that this business of being so divided is a lot simpler than it appears. The older Dems are now becoming the swing voters in the Fall.

That's so not surprising. Obama's tax proposal? Deadly. They don't like his relationship problem. They don't like his attitude. They just don't like the guy.

The new flood of progressives into the party used to be the swing voters.

All that has happened is that the demographics have flip-flopped.

What's new about this? Nothing, I think.

[ Parent ]

Obviously, the demographics have switched (none / 0) (#138)
by pie on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 10:44:21 AM EST

because we don't have a white man running in the dem primary. :-)

I think you're probably right about the amount of attention being paid, although the people I know here do not blog, but all are all following the race very closely. Maybe that's influencing the way I feel about division. One actually said about two months ago that she was leaning toward either Obama or McCain. Pretty stunning, isn't it? I haven't talked to her lately though.

It's still a while until November.

[ Parent ]

: My real life friends (none / 0) (#195)
by AnninCA on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 11:29:50 AM EST

are an eclectic bunch. They are cute. Even those who voted for Obama called me after PA to congratulate me. :)
They'll be happy to vote for Clinton in the Fall.
I had one die-hard activist friend. Frankly, she got on my nerves. I'm an emotional moderate. *haha

[ Parent ]

The canddiates... (none / 0) (#26)
by Salo on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:21:40 AM EST

...spent 250 million to avoid any issue based debates. I don't think the blogs did that to themselves.

At least their public participants didn't consciously do it. I can't speak for the semiprofessional Troll raters cadres that came to dominate or politically clense them.

[ Parent ]